tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post8418830999672408470..comments2023-11-10T04:17:00.492-05:00Comments on View From The Porch: We are so screwed.Tamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comBlogger71125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-47277935883591612572010-02-26T16:48:44.934-05:002010-02-26T16:48:44.934-05:00"OA, I think you just like seeing your words ..."OA, I think you just like seeing your words show up every time you refresh the page."<br /><br /><br />Yup, that must be it.<br /><br /><br />"Maybe you really think that 600,000+ American lives spent is better than finding a middle ground."<br /><br /><br />Nope, but hey, keep right on putting words in my mouth.<br /><br /><br />"If that's the case, I suggest you seek psychological assistance."<br /><br /><br />Make up a statement and try to make it look like those must be my feelings on the matter, then tell me I need physiological help for it...nice. Cripes, does this look like Democratic Underground to you? <br /><br />Further, actual deaths were much, much higher when factoring in civilians and fatalities years later from injuries sustained and starvation. Hell of a thing to put countries through for money.<br /><br /><br />"In your opinion, anyway. According to some folks, unless you are actively shooting at Federal officials you aren’t doing enough. Whereas simply showing up to vote is doing more than 40% of the population does."<br /><br /><br />In my opinion? Did you read the exchange with Joanna? Doesn't seem like it. Nor did either one of us advocate shooting federal officials.<br /><br /><br />"It's moot."<br /><br /><br />Clearly you think so.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-62803604216569435252010-02-26T16:05:10.363-05:002010-02-26T16:05:10.363-05:00OA, I think you just like seeing your words show u...OA, I think you just like seeing your words show up every time you refresh the page. <br /><br />Maybe you really think that 600,000+ American lives spent is better than finding a middle ground. If that's the case, I suggest you seek psychological assistance. <br /><br /><i>Only because yet others are making claims to be making a difference with what they're doing (when in reality they're only making a difference for themselves rather than the country, as implied).</i><br /><br />In your opinion, anyway. According to some folks, unless you are actively shooting at Federal officials you aren’t doing enough. Whereas simply showing up to vote is doing more than 40% of the population does. <br /><br /><i>Piss poor reading comprehension is the real bugger.</i><br /><br />It's moot. Most folks are so fixated on the point they want to make that the context of any rebuttal doesn't matter, simply the fact that someone opposes them is enough to continue a tirade.jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07682952829635407505noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-29078084949855686952010-02-26T13:59:19.471-05:002010-02-26T13:59:19.471-05:00"Southern motives were to preserve slavery an..."Southern motives were to preserve slavery and white supremacy."<br /><br />Perhaps, in the same way that Yankee motives were to nationalize assets, reward carpetbaggery, and create an entire subclass of beholden black dependency. Follow the money/power, then as now. <br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-62479352333099930212010-02-26T12:06:03.866-05:002010-02-26T12:06:03.866-05:00"An increasing amount. As more countries go d..."An increasing amount. As more countries go down the tubes economically (Greece so far, Spain will probably be next)..."<br /><br />Woops...Iceland. I forgot Iceland.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-50127835014024663552010-02-26T11:40:38.716-05:002010-02-26T11:40:38.716-05:00"Did Lincoln levy war against his country? Fr..."Did Lincoln levy war against his country? From his perspective, he certainly did: again, that's what the shooting was about. He thought the union was inseparable, and that the alliance between sovereign states made the United States a true country."<br /><br /><br />Lincoln's own pre-war words refute that. He didn't want to take the economic hit and have to deal with a potentially frisky England and France, plain and simple. If the USA would have been as strong without the CSA as with it, not a shot would have been fired.<br /><br /><br />"Looking across the Atlantic today, I wonder how many people in the countries of Europe realize that they are no longer citizens of France, of Italy, of Germany, but are instead citizens of the European Union."<br /><br /><br />An increasing amount. As more countries go down the tubes economically (Greece so far, Spain will probably be next), even more will figure it out (and the EU hasn't exactly been popular since the currency rolled out and prices for virtually everything doubled). It'll be interesting to see if the EU even exists in 30 years.<br /><br /><br />"If war in Europe broke out today, would Brits fighting to retain or regain their national sovereignity be traitors (to the EU), or patriots (to their own country)?"<br /><br /><br />Patriots. Hell, the EU arguably isn't even legal.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-20973722575431913902010-02-26T11:28:13.973-05:002010-02-26T11:28:13.973-05:00jeff said...
We have people arguing about a horri...jeff said... <br />We have people arguing about a horrific war that has little relevance except as a reminder of what happens when people refuse to comprimise.<br /><br /><br />Yeah, that Missouri Compromise worked out splendidly.<br /><br /><br />"Others are making like a WWII poster and asking what are YOU doing to make a difference, and not accepting it as enough, while failing to provide examples of what exactly that person should be doing. "<br /><br /><br />Only because yet others are making claims to be making a difference with what they're doing (when in reality they're only making a difference for themselves rather than the country, as implied). Seems natural to ask what exactly they are doing. You'll also note that none that inquired as to exactly what was being done made a single similar claim themselves. Further, I'm not going to tell anyone what they should be doing. If you desire that I suggest you go find your nearest micromanaging nanny-state supporter and poke them.<br /><br /><br />"This is why the internet is such a lousy place for a discusion."<br /><br />Piss poor reading comprehension is the real bugger.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-76415058866648601782010-02-26T11:07:49.764-05:002010-02-26T11:07:49.764-05:00I have lived on the west coast my whole life, and ...I have lived on the west coast my whole life, and while I may have had (probably <em>did</em> have) relatives on one side or the other of the Incivil War, I have no idea who they might have been or what they might have done. I say that only to say this, from the perspective of someone with no real passion for either side: <br /><br /><em>"Lincoln did not levy war on his country; the South did."</em><br /><br />That was, of course, the very point at issue when the shooting started. <br /><br />The citizens of Virginia were citizens of <em>Virginia</em> when the war started. They made no war on their country, because their country was the state of Virginia. Their country was not the union of political convenience between the states. They were patriots supporting their country when they marched to war to support that country's foreign policy and its attempts to disentangle itself from what its citizens had come to view as a dangerous foreign alliance.<br /><br />Calling it treason against their country when the war was fought over that very question is downright disingenuous. <br /><br />Did Lincoln levy war against his country? From his perspective, he certainly did: again, that's what the shooting was about. He thought the union was inseparable, and that the alliance between sovereign states made the United States a true country.<br /><br />The south was wrong in part because a state can no more give up part of its sovereignty than a lady can give up part of her virtue -- as they and everyone discovered. To their sorrow. The war was already lost the day they ceded "some of" their states' sovereignty away and joined the union. All the rest was just bookkeeping details, heartbreaking as they became.<br /><br />Looking across the Atlantic today, I wonder how many people in the countries of Europe realize that they are no longer citizens of France, of Italy, of Germany, but are instead citizens of the European Union. If war in Europe broke out today, would Brits fighting to retain or regain their national sovereignity be traitors (to the EU), or patriots (to their own country)?<br /><br />Don't say "it depends who wins," because that's entirely irrelevant to their actual motivations. That would be sloppy journalism -- and it's equally sloppy as history.<br /><br />The people who write the history books get to demonize the motivations and characters of the people who lost. But it hardly changes the thing as it IS to the people with boots on the ground.paxhttp://www.corneredcat.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-18732675834563530062010-02-26T10:41:31.410-05:002010-02-26T10:41:31.410-05:00Wow, this one went far afield. We have people argu...Wow, this one went far afield. We have people arguing about a horrific war that has little relevance except as a reminder of what happens when people refuse to comprimise. Others are making like a WWII poster and asking what are YOU doing to make a difference, and not accepting it as enough, while failing to provide examples of what exactly that person should be doing. <br /><br />This is why the internet is such a lousy place for a discusion. We all sit behind our keyboards, smug in our moral and idealogical superiority, and simply pound away that WE ARE RIGHT, YOU ARE WRONG. Bah. <br /><br />Of course, it does give me some reading material while I sip my coffee.jeffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07682952829635407505noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-10006191271969456262010-02-26T09:40:11.607-05:002010-02-26T09:40:11.607-05:00A reminder: Chewbacca and his clan have kicked imp...A reminder: Chewbacca and his clan have kicked imperial storm-trooper butt from the binary blasted wastes of Arkanis to the Lesai bazaars of Zebitrope VIII.<br /><br />Wookies have ALWAYS made better friends than enemies...Just sayin'.monkeyfanhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vahbbcI-6jgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-34566069965689366272010-02-26T08:40:22.545-05:002010-02-26T08:40:22.545-05:00I think you're a little confused about who wan...I think you're a little confused about who wants "something for nothing".<br /><br />There's somebody here saying "<i>Wah-wah-wah! I want lots of cops and clean streets and good schools and shiny bombers and foreign adventures and snappy uniforms and no child left behind...</i> and I don't want to pay any taxes<i>!</i>"<br /><br />...but they ain't wearing a wookie suit. "Adult" my butt.Tamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-80733613259345670792010-02-26T07:52:12.709-05:002010-02-26T07:52:12.709-05:00Boo hoo hoo, Lincoln didn't like Black people ...Boo hoo hoo, Lincoln didn't like Black people either so Treason to preserve slavery is just fine. Lincoln did not levy war on his country; the South did. Southern motives were to preserve slavery and white supremacy.<br /> <br />General Early is very proud that his efforts of shifting focus away from slavery and onto some other cause are being rewarded today.<br /><br />Health care reform is far removed from slavery which caused the War of Southern Treason. There will be no violence, save for the comic books of Libertarians.<br /><br />Shootin' BuddyAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-46905131793217781032010-02-25T23:42:04.441-05:002010-02-25T23:42:04.441-05:00"In other words, I choose to focus most of my..."In other words, I choose to focus most of my attention on nearer things. I can actually make an immediate difference there. The government and the country will go on with or without me. My life, obligations and relationships won't."<br /><br />That's a pretty good mini-manifesto for the modern libertarian. My son is your age and shares your attitude of self reliance and personal responsibility; it heartens me that there are many young people that have resisted being bought by the nanny state.<br /><br />But so many are blinded by the light that while you're over there minding your own business, that government that "will go on without" you is busy co-opting all of that self-determination right out from under you. Discussing and countering that trend demands at least some of our attention while we keep on keepin' on with our own lives, and that's just what we're doing right here. <br /><br />Hope your ankle is better, but that getting back your ambulatory won't keep you from making yourself heard.<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-83002046507125052172010-02-25T23:39:40.741-05:002010-02-25T23:39:40.741-05:00You could call me a Van Pelt, I suppose -- I have ...You could call me a Van Pelt, I suppose -- I have a low tolerance for nonsense, and I'm generally not afraid to say so. :-) <br /><br />What have I done? I've marched on fucking Washington, that's what I've done. Other than that, I stay as informed as possible and I share what I learn -- with the resources currently at my disposal, that's about the extent of my options. And about my last paragraph -- the single most American thing I can do right now is become as self-sufficient as possible. I can't bring down bad laws or destroy corrupt ideas; the only way I can fight them is to make sure they have no place in my life. So that's what I do. Just because I'm not ministering to tribes in Africa doesn't mean I'm not doing the Lord's work, as it were. <br /><br />And for the record, I'm a svelte 26-year-old female. I don't own a vest. :-)Joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10952078709114872197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-12036878949696385272010-02-25T23:21:41.712-05:002010-02-25T23:21:41.712-05:00So in other words you decided to be a wet blanket ...So in other words you decided to be a wet blanket because you don't like the discussion about things that you see as not impacting your daily life? Actual question, as I'm a bit confused as to your grounds for playing den mother. You certainly have the right to your opinion, but isn't that what everyone else is indulging as well? You're not a Van Pelt, by any chance?<br /><br /><br />"Will I do everything in my power to counter and undermine unreasonable and unAmerican government actions? You're damn right I will."<br /><br />I ask again, what have you done? You keep making these blustery statements like a pudgy 50 year old white guy in a shoot me first vest yet somehow I doubt you've done "everything" in your power to "counter and undermine unreasonable and unAmerican government actions", or much of anything at all...unless you consider crabassing about it online to be the extent of your powers. Further, your last paragraph directly contradicts your claims of doing everything in your power to "counter and undermine unreasonable and unAmerican government actions".<br /><br /><br />Yup, I'd say it's late winter.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-65667308197805717682010-02-25T22:59:24.969-05:002010-02-25T22:59:24.969-05:00What "real work" and "stuff" d...<i>What "real work" and "stuff" do you advocate needs doing so urgently?</i> <br /><br />My life. I find that keeping my apartment clean and paying my debts on time is a better use of my energy than freaking out about the next big War of Mom He's Touching Me Again. (And before you ask: The only reason I've been in this thread so long is because I've been off work all week and I'm laid up with a bum ankle.) <br /><br />That's not to say I don't think about the future and what might happen. I do. Quite a lot, actually. But if there's one thing I know it's that revolution should only ever be an absolute last resort. It's exciting to talk about taking down the system and fighting the man, but let's face it: It's just talk. Will I do everything in my power to counter and undermine unreasonable and unAmerican government actions? You're damn right I will. But there won't be another Concorde or Lexington, and I think it would be foolish to force the issue. <br /><br />In other words, I choose to focus most of my attention on nearer things. I can actually make an immediate difference there. The government and the country will go on with or without me. My life, obligations and relationships won't.Joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10952078709114872197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-3209841240505154322010-02-25T22:40:41.741-05:002010-02-25T22:40:41.741-05:00Oh. This sure reads like you're talking about ...Oh. This sure reads like you're talking about history:<br /><br />"...you can argue all day long about who was right and who was wrong, but it won't change the reality of who won and who lost...it happened, it's over and the sooner we all adjust to that fact the sooner we can get some real work done around here..."<br /><br />The future is coming and it's not hypothetical; there is huge benefit in learning from history so as not to repeat it. And doing "stuff" without openly discussing differences is how "shit" happens, and how we all ended up with such a giant stinking pile of it.<br /><br />What "real work" and "stuff" do you advocate needs doing so urgently?<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-3379517848156236992010-02-25T22:18:49.455-05:002010-02-25T22:18:49.455-05:00these guys aren't talking about the last civil...<i>these guys aren't talking about the last civil war, they're talking about the next one.</i> <br /><br />Again: Shit happens. I've got a big enough pile of it to deal with now without adding a bunch of hypotheticals to the mix. Quit talking; get stuff done; rinse; repeat. Nobody benefits from this kind of argument in the end.Joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10952078709114872197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-88657307233648919622010-02-25T20:58:03.941-05:002010-02-25T20:58:03.941-05:00Joanna, these guys aren't talking about the la...Joanna, these guys aren't talking about the last civil war, they're talking about the next one.<br /><br />SB's blathering is fear; fear that there will be a secession or split of some kind, along some lines, in the near future. And if you think the economic engine of the country was in the South in the 1850's, just consider the situation today.<br /><br />Forced unity is always a pursuit of assets...follow the money. And then as now racism is a calculated diversion.<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-60223524832536293262010-02-25T20:47:45.635-05:002010-02-25T20:47:45.635-05:00"I just have more of a stake in getting shit ..."I just have more of a stake in getting shit done instead of arguing over who spit in whose milk first."<br /><br />Well, that begs a question...exactly what shit are you getting done? About a much as everyone else (which is to say "not a hell of a lot"), right?OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-4189424246103306592010-02-25T20:26:56.838-05:002010-02-25T20:26:56.838-05:00OA said...
Gewehr98 said...
One word:
...<i>OA said...<br /><br /> Gewehr98 said...<br /> One word:<br /><br /> Andersonville.<br /><br /><br /> One word:<br /> Elmira. </i> <br /><br />Four words: It's war. Shit happens. <br /><br />In other words, you can argue all day long about who was right and who was wrong, but it won't change the reality of who won and who lost. And I really don't give two hoots about northern aggression or white supremacy or what have you; the point is that it happened, it's over and the sooner we all adjust to that fact the sooner we can get some real work done around here. <br /><br />And for the record, I have a so-many-greats uncle who was in Andersonville; he spent the rest of his life in the asylum. So it's not like I don't have a stake in this. I just have more of a stake in getting shit done instead of arguing over who spit in whose milk first.Joannahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10952078709114872197noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-2229616620106576932010-02-25T19:59:45.400-05:002010-02-25T19:59:45.400-05:00More like Crap & Rape.More like Crap & Rape.Crotalusnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-9210890808443085652010-02-25T19:49:14.066-05:002010-02-25T19:49:14.066-05:00TJP said...
"...the Democrats' ridiculou...TJP said... <br />"...the Democrats' ridiculous spending spree during a recession..."<br /><br />Not so funny thing about that...if you take the government's spending that's been directly aimed at "stopping the bleeding" out of the equation, the economic contraction is at 10%. That qualifies it for a depression.<br /><br />Have I mentioned that the commercial real estate market hasn't really started its true fall yet? Or that most of the bad home mortgages are still off the books and festering for the banks? Or that Europe is spectacularly far up the creek? (Greece? Hell, everyone thought Spain would go first...)OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-22063995850880261722010-02-25T19:41:37.572-05:002010-02-25T19:41:37.572-05:00"Because when you levy war on your country yo..."Because when you levy war on your country you commit Treason and you deserve to swing."<br /><br />Yet again:<br />"Any people anywhere being inclined and having the power have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better."<br /><br />By Lincoln's own words the Confederacy was its own country. Later, as president, he didn't want the competition because he new good and well who Europe would favor.<br /><br />And I guess all the Founding Fathers deserved to swing, eh?<br /><br />"The war wasn't about slavery and white supremacy?"<br /><br />Lincoln again: <br />"I will say then, that I am not nor have ever been in favor of bringing about in any way, the social and political equality of the white and black races, that I am not, nor have I ever been in favor of making voters of the negroes, or jurors, or qualifying them to hold office, or having them to marry with white people...there must be the position of superior and inferior, that I as much as any other man am in favor of the superior position being assigned to the white man."<br /><br />You, Shootin' Buddy, are a blithering idiot and a bigot. End of discussion.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-58784503453891233752010-02-25T19:39:27.482-05:002010-02-25T19:39:27.482-05:00Gewehr98 said...
One word:
Andersonville.
One ...Gewehr98 said... <br />One word:<br /><br />Andersonville.<br /><br /><br />One word:<br />Elmira.OAnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-19585213870956482522010-02-25T19:39:26.409-05:002010-02-25T19:39:26.409-05:00Whatever the outcome of this 'Healthcare' ...Whatever the outcome of this 'Healthcare' theater they had today, the fact remains that come next fall Republicans can't win big without the help and endorsements of the most conservative members of our VOTING society.<br /><br />The Democrats, however, can retain their plurality without the help of their most liberal members of our political spectrum. They really don't need them.<br /><br />So, the question remains will the Republicans sincerely move their political positions to those that Conservatives demand or we will get the usual heave-ho once they think they've got the votes they need to resume power?<br /><br />We have been bitten so many times by this dog I don't trust the lot of them (on either side)...<br /><br />All The Best,<br />Frank W. JamesFrank W. Jameshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07589579734134153159noreply@blogger.com