The last name of the guy who ignored the "No Guns Allowed" signs in California was:
- O'Flynn
- Ivanov
- DiMaggio
- Smith
- Zawahri
Interesting that the handgun in the pictures appears to be an Italian clone of the percussion ("cap-and-ball") Remington Model 1858 with a cartridge conversion cylinder installed. Any members of The Resistance behind the lines in California know the legal status of black powder revolvers out there?
Last time I checked, (and it's been awhile) they were classified as antiques and not firearms, even modern replicas. You can buy them and not fill out a shred of paperwork.
ReplyDeleteAlso I just went to order just such a replica online at Cabela's with no restrictions listed for California.
The handgun appears to have nipples on it so it probably wasn't re-configured in any way. Just a black powder revolver in my opinion. The .44 rounds could easily just be there because this guy was crazy and possibly an idiot and thought .44 black powder revolver shot .44 magnum rounds out of it.
ReplyDeleteAnyone else notice they left the lower out of all the pictures? Probably either had a bullet button and they are hiding the fact it means nothing, or it didn't have one and it shows the law means nothing.
David W.,
ReplyDelete"The handgun appears to have nipples on it..."
That is a conversion cylinder. Trust me.
http://www.oldsouthfirearms.com/images/products/detail/Kirst1858KonverterCW.1.jpg
But-but, AR15s are ILLEGAL IN CALIFORNIA! At least in the configuration shown with him holding it while walking into the library. I'd guess it had no bullet button and it definitely was not within the limits of the law. But don't expect a wasted crisis in California. More onerous restrictions are now forthcoming.
ReplyDeleteRegardless of whether or not the AR15 was illegal or not. The man has recently been committed to a mental institution. Thus stopping him from legally purchasing a firearm. So, my guess his illegal AR15 was also purchased illegally, thus illustrating that in fact criminals don't care about the law.
This is my shocked face.
-Rob
I'm also very curious about why the lower is not present. I really can't think of a good reason, tin-foily or otherwise.
ReplyDeleteAlso, what's with the blue mags?
SCM,
ReplyDelete"Also, what's with the blue mags?"
Probably old .mil "pre-ban" training mags; note the motley assortment of worn GI 30-rounders there.
Sepulvedasrevenge:
ReplyDeleteA modern replica needs to stay cap and ball to stay out of federal jurisdiction. Add a conversion cylinder, and it becomes a modern cartridge revolver.
Pre-1898 guns remain pre-1898 guns, even if converted to cartridges.
Curio and Relic post 1898 firearms lose their C & R status if subjected to modern sporterization.
Hope this helps.
http://www.rawles.to/Pre-1899_FAQ.html
The pity is that his upper appears to be a well done R607 clone.
ReplyDeleteDestined for the smelter?
Kristophr,
ReplyDelete"A modern replica needs to stay cap and ball to stay out of federal jurisdiction."
With Title I guns, which is what the gun would be with a conversion cylinder in it, federal jurisdiction doesn't have much to say about possession.
Correct, other than the federal restrictions on possession by prohibited persons.
ReplyDeleteCalifornia's handgun list only applies to sales, as I recall. New residents must register handguns they brought in within 60 days. Newly bought handguns are registered by the dealer. All handguns are only to be sold by dealers.
I can't find anything concerning home manufacture of revolvers, however,other than enhanced penalties for crimes committed with unregistered handguns.
Trolling the old THR forums, I don't see anything concerning CA laws on possession of a cap and ball, other than trumping up something under their generic dangerous weapons statute.
ReplyDeleteAnd it is a crime to have more than a pound of black powder in possession in CA.
You can buy black powder weapons here with nothing but the cash and the desire, and mail order them right to your house. Ditto for the powder, caps, and lead balls.
ReplyDeleteYeah, those Gun Free Zones are working out well.
If only having an armed officer or three on the scene had prevented futher needless slaughter, like the NRA said.
And however much of a jackhole this kid was, let's give him props for chosing to go off in the People's Republik of Santa Monicastan.
Say it with me:
"You can ignore reality, but you can't ignore the consequences of ignoring reality."
Didn't he know full capacity magazines and standard-format ARs are illegal in Cali?
ReplyDelete(Is the horse dead yet?)
I'm puzzled by how he was able to simply *walk* while carrying 1300 rounds, in loaded mags, of poodle-shooter caliber. (Doing the math, that comes to 43 1/3 loaded mags, which is still A LOT more than most troops carry in bad places, double or triple the max loadout from what I've heard.)
ReplyDeleteHe had a car for most of it. Hauling 50-60 pounds in a dufflebag the last hundred yards, if he took them all into the library, isn't that big a deal.
ReplyDeleteSince I could not be bothered to thoroughly read the article, having already heard the female officer on the radio news talk about the 1300 rounds, scanning it quickly, and looking at the photos with all of the thoughts above, if he was carrying 44 mag cartridges, they would be useless in all of the 1858 style revolvers I have ever seen as the big ones (Army) have a .451 bore and are converted to .45 Colt loaded to Cowboy action pressures. The Navy version is 36 Cal, I think. Perhaps I missed the reference in the article.
ReplyDeleteWhy is that most of the immediate reporting (?) is linked to the Mail (UK)?
ReplyDeleteDon't WE have newspapers anymore? //Sarc off//
As to SJS, consider all those corner gas stations staffed by Apu and brethren...
ReplyDeleteWhich state legislatures are still in session and considering gun control issues? The only thing I know of offhand is Nevada Gov. is on the fence about vetoing a Universal Background Check bill.
ReplyDeleteAssuming the pistol and AR were legally purchased, it would seem that the California Gun Gestapo that's supposed to come around and collect guns from newly-created prohibited posessors has missed another chance.
Wonder what new gun-control legislation will be created and pushed from this incident. Any bets as to whether it will be proposed and published and pimped before Wednesday?
A couple observations: the dropped magazines at the scene had rounds left in (tactical reloads), and there is a pistol magazine with no gun for it to fit in.
ReplyDeleteOT, but Shorpy has an antediluvian picture of Broad Ripple pre-hipsters...
ReplyDelete"As to SJS, consider all those corner gas stations staffed by Apu and brethren..."
ReplyDeleteI don't think jihad is really a Hindu thing.
rickn8or,
ReplyDelete"Assuming the pistol and AR were legally purchased..."
The pistol wasn't a firearm and could have been bought through the mail, with the cylinder acquired separately.
Doubletrouble,
ReplyDeleteNewspapers here don't report it unless it's a white, christian republican doing the shooting.
Now that I know the alleged perp's last name, I understand the lack of hue and cry ("See?! See?!?! Told ya we needed a ban!!!) from the MSM. Man it must hurt to let an opportunity to flog gun bans go by in the support of multiculturalism.
ReplyDeleteErp. That would be Abu, as a broad reference to jihadists, their fathers and their prophets. Point being, if/when the call goes out to the faithful, that's a bunch of handy neighborhood bombs.
ReplyDeleteTam, it looks to me like it's still cap & ball, but it's hard to tell. IAC have you noticed the photos showing the front of the cylinder?
ReplyDeleteIT'S STILL LOADED!
"Tam, it looks to me like it's still cap & ball, but it's hard to tell."
ReplyDeleteNo, it is not hard to tell. It has a conversion cylinder in it, plain as day. Look at the link in my first comment in this thread.
(The reason it's still loaded is probably because nobody there knew how to get the cylinder out to unload it.)
ReplyDelete(The reason it still looks like a cap and ball is because the cylinder has a backplate with a separate firing pin for each chamber that looks kind of like the nipple on a percussion cylinder. You can see the seam between the backplate and the cylinder body clearly in the photos.)
ReplyDelete"Assuming the pistol and AR were legally purchased..."
ReplyDeletePerhaps I should have said "legally possessed..."
I'm wondering if that conversion cylinder is legal in California though.
I must confess my only interest in "California" and "guns" is trying to convince my Oakland daughter-in-lawyer to get some kind of protection for my grandsons.
The police chief said he had an "extra receiver". Perhaps she meant upper and the junk on the bunk display was just what he was carrying in the bag. The display doesn't include his vest and there aren't any kneepads visible in the pic of the dood.
ReplyDeleteBesides, although the surveillance photo is low res and grainy, I've kinda had some doubts that the profile of the upper he is actually carrying is the same as the the one on the display.
I'm with Tam on the conversion, having owned a number of Remington 1858 replicas (and a conversion cylinder or two) over the years. Unlike converted percussion 1861 Colts where the loading lever is often removed, the Remington loading lever is usually left intact because it needs to operate as originally designed to retain/allow access to the cylinder pin. It is, as Tam says, that line at the back of the cylinder that gives it away. Even in an abused weapon with scraping from the cylinder lock, the line would be forward of the one clearly visible in those photos.
ReplyDeleteThe Remingtons (and Italian replicas) in their unconverted form are very dependable for percussion revolvers. I'd take one over the Colt any day.
1) I love how the Mail calls 1 and a half guns an "arsenal".
ReplyDelete2) "Santa Monica Police Chief Jacqueline Seabrook said given the amount of ammunition and tactical gear found on the suspect, investigators believe the rampage was pre-meditated"
No shit, Sherlock. You mean he didn't normally run around with an AR, 30 magazines, and a single-action revolver on campus, illegally, and just happen to snap today?
3) He was not sufficiently Tacti-cool, since that AR has A1 sights.
Am I the only person on the planet to wonder why the law dragged the perp's lifeless body outside to pronounce him deceased? I have done quite a fair bunch of pronouncin' and, while I can appreciate the pleasures of fresh air and natural sunlight, I have never found being indoors an impediment to detecting death.
ReplyDeleteAnd the LA County Coroner's Office is particularly particular regarding the law, or anyone else, messing with the publicly dead until they have completed their investigation of same.
I don't know squat about California's laws since I live far from there and never plan to visit, but on the topic of his name: I had wondered if it was being withheld because they wanted to delay telling us that this was SJS.
ReplyDeleteThat being said, since his first name was John, not Yahia--the Arabic equivalent, and since his brother was named Christopher, I'd guess the parents were Christians who immigrated here and gave their children Western names rather than Arabic versions like some folks I know.
Unless he converted and went Jihadi pretty quickly, I'd guess that the initial reports of mental issues are probably more relevant here.
Conversion cylinders are quite legal here, as >5K S.A.S.S. shooters would tell you, even in Santa Monicastan.
ReplyDeleteCarrying loaded weapons is not.
And yes, the lack of the basic idea about removing said cylinder conversion is undoubtedly the reason it'sstill loaded at the show and tell, jus as the perp's ethnic identity contributed to the warp-speed squelching of all subsequent hue and cry about the incident, even hereabouts.
If not for 2000 cellphone pics, they likely would have attributed all the incidents to serial randomness, and summer lightning storms.
Besides, by Santa Monicastan standards, this guy is pathetic. 80-year-olds with Buicks have murderd more masses there than crazy jihadi-sounding mental patients with evil black rifles and poor impulse control.
As Casey Stengel said, you could look it up:
http://www.cnn.com/2003/US/West/07/16/farmers.market.crash/
"Also, what's with the blue mags?"
ReplyDeletehttp://www.keepshooting.com/colored-ar15-m16-magazine.html
What are the odds the "extra receiver" was another cylinder for the revolver?
ReplyDeleteThe extra receiver was most likely the upper in the junk-on-the-bunk display.
ReplyDelete