tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post315405416864330900..comments2023-11-10T04:17:00.492-05:00Comments on View From The Porch: Putting the cart before the horse.Tamhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comBlogger34125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-80291460214295426652011-06-30T08:00:54.798-04:002011-06-30T08:00:54.798-04:00Jake,
Why, yes. I believe this is referred to as...Jake,<br /><br />Why, yes. I believe this is referred to as "thinning the gene pool". Allow those that wish to risk, and lose, their lives being dramatic and exciting (i.e., court danger in inordinate ways).<br /><br />Works for me.<br /><br />Keep in mind, fewer roads today are as well kept as they were in the 1960s, and that isn't likely to get better any time soon. Also, folk in rural and urban areas are driving vehicles from tractors to cars and trucks that need maintenance, and won't be traveling more than 10-45 mph -- and drivers will still be pulling out in front of you, unexpectedly.<br /><br />Enjoy. YMMV.Brad K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/18378344866487206569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-74246583065003636492011-06-30T02:56:05.521-04:002011-06-30T02:56:05.521-04:00While we're at it, can we ban statutory speed ...While we're at it, can we ban statutory speed limits in rural areas? If I can safely do 115 because it's a clear day, there is no one else on the road, and my car is in great mechanical shape ... Why shouldn't I be allowed to?Jakenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-42246513114081296492011-06-29T21:20:37.835-04:002011-06-29T21:20:37.835-04:00@ Staghounds,
Recall that there were those that w...@ Staghounds,<br /><br />Recall that there were those that wanted to ban airline travel as un-natural, and playing rock-and-roll in cars as being obviously causing too many wrecks. Cigarettes -- lighting, getting the next one out, dealing with the ashes -- was shown to cause wrecks, but the efforts to get that banned never amounted to much. Now some cities ban fast food while driving for the very same problems.<br /><br />Last week I encountered a woman leaving the local Wal-Mart parking lot, with a new novel (still had Wal-Mart price tag on the dust jacket) held to the top of the steering wheel, reading away while driving.<br /><br />I mean, really. I decided years ago that we shouldn't read while driving. It makes the other drivers nervous.<br /><br />As for "easy to prove", I imagine that another consequence is that there will be a black market for gadgets and programs to fudge the records, so there is no legal evidence about texting and time frames.<br /><br />But you miss the point. The point is not that some instances can be ticketed before an accident occurs. Heck, now that cities have camera tickets for "running" red lights, they are playing games with shortening the time for yellow lights to increase revenues from tickets. Explain to me how either ticketing by camera reduces accidents, or shortening yellow caution light intervals reduces accidents.<br /><br />With "Driving while x" laws, including texting, you ignore the fact that some folk do, over the course of a lifetime, learn to drive while x. Yes, the drunk drivers do have more accidents, and they are tragic. Yet most neighborhoods have a poor sot that everyone knows drives the same back route, the same time, the same days, the same advanced level of intoxication. Or putting on makeup during the morning commute, or talking on the cell phone, or listening to rock and roll on the radio, or playing the recorder .. uh, anyway.<br /><br />Should we ban grammar, because some people haven't learned grammar? Should we ban voting, because some places and people violate voting laws? Should we ban hand guns because some police shoot innocent people, or can't be bothered with double checking the target address? Should we ban long guns because President Obama sold guns to the Mexico drug cartels (Gunwalker/BATFE)?<br /><br />Should we ban military enlistments, because not everyone survives with an honorable discharge? Should we ban marriage because some people just want the sex? (Ooh, but officer I have two witnesses that heard him say he wanted a family!)<br /><br />The tighter the regulations, the more disrespect people have for the body of laws, and the more people tend to pick and choose what law to obey, and what they consider obedience. There are a couple of communities now that have withdrawn all traffic laws in their jurisdiction, removed all traffic signs and lane marks. Each came up with fewer accidents, fewer injuries, and fewer deaths.<br /><br />The "obvious" dangers that must be outlawed, too frequently mean that someone is required to be looking.<br /><br />Police have no responsibility to safeguard any individual (they "protect" the community, not individuals, according to the Supreme Court), they cannot and do not police every individual all the time. Enforcement is by nature hit-or-miss, depending mostly on statistics and who happens to see what. That is, no restrictive law can ever be completely effective -- only enforced. Anything that improves enforcement, without improving effectiveness, is like fighting a war on drugs, on poverty, and on terrorism -- great political slogans and lengthy federal career paths, with no benefit to the nation.Brad K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/18378344866487206569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-40630080090544961132011-06-29T21:20:07.560-04:002011-06-29T21:20:07.560-04:00@ Tam,
You left out "Driving While Under the...@ Tam,<br /><br />You left out "Driving While Under the influence of Adrenaline", which last for 28 minutes (according to my teacher manual, "Teaching Tools"). Like, say, after the Police cruiser just camped within 15 feet of my back bumper for the last mile, or buzzed from a really great, exciting movie, like, oh, "Nuns on the Run" or "Sound of Music 2", "Hannah Montana", or even a re-run of that quirky love story, "Hitman".Brad K.https://www.blogger.com/profile/18378344866487206569noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-8799020904749351812011-06-29T00:14:18.755-04:002011-06-29T00:14:18.755-04:00Hello Tam,
In a previuos life, (30 yrs ago) I drov...Hello Tam,<br />In a previuos life, (30 yrs ago) I drove a semi around so-cal. I got a great view of the dumb ones. My opinion is most of the people driving need to be on the bus bench. That includes the bus driver. All of the laws to protect us from us are passed by the idgits for the stupid.<br /><br />DS<br /> Never be in a rush to die.diesel smokehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12423006842523412765noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-78861928427986141942011-06-28T16:29:35.961-04:002011-06-28T16:29:35.961-04:00Hell, they don't need to pass ANOTHER law for ...Hell, they don't need to pass ANOTHER law for the income generating; just use what's already there.<br /><br />When the idiots at the state capital were busy working on a 'driving while texting' law, somebody asked "Why not use the damned reckless or careless driving laws already on the books?" The answer boiled down to "Not specific enough/doesn't <i>quite</i> cover it/because we want a new law."<br /><br />Frikkin' idiots.Firehandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04562365951182027709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-23974423726640572002011-06-28T12:55:15.220-04:002011-06-28T12:55:15.220-04:00Cowboy Rick vetoed the no twd out here in Texas. ...Cowboy Rick vetoed the no twd out here in Texas. <br /><br />FredAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-10933788013883202052011-06-28T12:37:06.334-04:002011-06-28T12:37:06.334-04:00"It has nothing to do with safety and all to ..."It has nothing to do with safety and all to do with generating revenue. Like seatbelt laws."<br /><br />Oohrah.oghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07551049745184408924noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-14901991722705900992011-06-28T11:50:49.043-04:002011-06-28T11:50:49.043-04:00It has nothing to do with safety and all to do wit...It has nothing to do with safety and all to do with generating revenue. Like seatbelt laws.<br /><br />As said here several times, if safety is the concern then the only actionable offense should be endangering others by crossing the lines, weaving in traffic, bouncing off curbs, etc, or causing a collision. At the time of the collision the reason you were driving in an unsafe manner could be used as a mitigating circumstance in determining the penalty.<br /><br />The problem with this is that it does not allow the LEOs to generate revenue by just pulling you over and accusing you, writing you a citation, and then causing you to spend more in time and lost wages than the fine to defend yourself against it. <br /><br />This generates revenue and THAT is the reason for the law.<br /><br />LeaddogLeaddognoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-73601537225417747082011-06-28T11:30:42.091-04:002011-06-28T11:30:42.091-04:00I generally agree with Tam's point, and every ...I generally agree with Tam's point, and every state has a recklessness statute.<br /><br />I believe the problem is that some things are so predictably dangerous that they rise to the level of intentionally making yourself dangerous as a driver, AND they can be detected and proven before the self-made-dangerous driver actually kills somebody.<br /><br />So some driving while ___ make sense. Drunk, nine years old, blind, car without brakes.<br /><br />It's a legislative decision whether "texting" falls in there or not.<br /><br />The "no harm no foul" element is provided by the need that there be a reasonable, articulable suspicion to stop the car. So no foul, no catch.<br /><br />FWMOIW, driving while texting is as stupid and dangerous to the texter and me as driving while blindfolded. And I think the startling/concealment effects of the law on the people stupid enough to violate it probably make the roads no safer.<br /><br />The real effect of DWT laws is that it can be proven after a wreck (by telephone records) and used to assign fault in civil cases.staghoundshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05976667812875074135noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-17539334035758908572011-06-28T08:52:26.370-04:002011-06-28T08:52:26.370-04:00"I'm sure there are plenty more laws and ..."I'm sure there are plenty more laws and prohibitions coming soon to a traffic code near you!"<br /><br />Yep, we could change the old saw to: "nothing's for sure but death, taxes...and laws, lotsa laws."<br /><br />Man, ya gotta have a lawyer just to live, die, and walk around...waitaminute...scratch that.<br /><br />Kill all the lawyers!<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-66783722277879279022011-06-28T08:38:00.430-04:002011-06-28T08:38:00.430-04:00"Oh, this is all just pie-in-the-sky stuff an..."Oh, this is all just pie-in-the-sky stuff anyway. I'm sure there are plenty more laws and prohibitions coming soon to a traffic code near you!"<br /><br />Yeah, my rep (Heath Shuler) wants to kiss up to Mothers Against Drinking and give away 60 million more of our tax dollers, to add $2000 to the price of all new cars by putting alcohol sensors in them....Roberthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02996122023499439670noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-15692658026047056442011-06-28T08:22:12.353-04:002011-06-28T08:22:12.353-04:00I still see people here in the People's Republ...I still see people here in the People's Republic of Taxachusetts texting while on the road. As one of the people said above, they're hiding the device down by their crotch instead of on the wheel. It's obvious what they're doing - how long before someone dies because of the law and the stupid people who can't keep their mind on the road...<br /><br />Joe R.Joe R.noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-1940616818133193182011-06-28T07:36:22.559-04:002011-06-28T07:36:22.559-04:00It's teh gummints job to keep it's subject...It's teh gummints job to keep it's subject safe and to tell them what they can and can't buy or do with their own property. And it's good intentions that count, not results. I think that's in the Constitution. Near the front or something.<br /><br />See? And folks said I didn't pay attention in Civics class.New Jovian Thunderbolthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09452246769246304612noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-65688004806899312352011-06-28T06:55:26.462-04:002011-06-28T06:55:26.462-04:00AT,
"So reckless = impaired?"
No "...AT,<br /><br />"<i>So reckless = impaired?</i>"<br /><br />No "reckless=reckless".<br /><br />The action is the offense, not the reason for the action. It doesn't matter if you crossed the double yellow because you were inept or impaired, the problem is that you crossed the double yellow.<br /><br />"<i>...so good luck with that.</i>"<br /><br />Oh, this is all just pie-in-the-sky stuff anyway. I'm sure there are plenty more laws and prohibitions coming soon to a traffic code near you!Tamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-32923480024504769652011-06-28T02:01:05.365-04:002011-06-28T02:01:05.365-04:00Oh, we're a loooong way from "no harm, no...Oh, we're a loooong way from "no harm, no foul". <br /><br />I don't hear people saying "it's a free country" much these days, either.<br /><br />Nice of you to express that sentiment, though.BS Footprinthttp://bsfootprint.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-60759118403037397772011-06-28T01:32:10.593-04:002011-06-28T01:32:10.593-04:00The Law of Unintended Consequences always applies....The Law of Unintended Consequences always applies.Cincinnatushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10424218376882403880noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-12513464361099629382011-06-27T23:53:21.841-04:002011-06-27T23:53:21.841-04:00Just My 2¢ said..."Another solution is "...Just My 2¢ said..."Another solution is "Idiot in possession of a motor vehicle.""<br /><br />Good luck getting that one past the congress critters. I doubt they'd want their licenses revoked.Robnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-16142606968012930182011-06-27T23:47:49.026-04:002011-06-27T23:47:49.026-04:00No preemptive law? I like it. Lotta job security a...No preemptive law? I like it. Lotta job security at risk there though, so good luck with that.<br /><br />"...the actionable offense is reckless driving."<br /><br />So reckless = impaired?<br /><br />And in virtually every instance, impaired = stoopid. Damn subjective definitions. Unfortunately, stoopid is not an actionable offense, though as the root of so much recklessness and impairment it should be. But you know, definitions again. <br /><br />And driving is just one of those many twigs, ain't it?<br /><br />"This is not complicated."<br /><br />Oh it is.<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-11200125757531089352011-06-27T23:04:00.587-04:002011-06-27T23:04:00.587-04:00(ie, if your driving is not visibly impaired, then...(ie, if your driving is not visibly impaired, then you are not driving while impaired. If you actually hit something and there is evidence of impairment, then you were driving while impaired. This is not complicated.)Tamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-84232803784620175122011-06-27T23:02:31.060-04:002011-06-27T23:02:31.060-04:00"The "actionable offense" is teh St..."<i>The "actionable offense" is teh Stoopid...</i>"<br /><br />No, the actionable offense is reckless driving. ;)Tamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-4660113931652528622011-06-27T22:30:28.165-04:002011-06-27T22:30:28.165-04:00"...and who...gives a good goddam WHY they......"...and who...gives a good goddam WHY they..."<br /><br />That would be the legislators that I mentioned who slash at twigs while the root runs ever deeper, which I thought was your point but apparently not, so I guess you returned the favor by by allowing mine to whiz right past, Ms. I-want-to-ride-my-damn-bike-in-the-9 p.m.-daylight-no-matter-how-hypocritical-that-may-be-Tamara-Keel.<br /><br />The "actionable offense" is teh Stoopid, so until they come up with a "citation" for that, I guess we can use all the others to wipe our asses for all the good they do. Get the point?<br /><br />ATAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-20835387985553389502011-06-27T22:00:14.497-04:002011-06-27T22:00:14.497-04:00without looking at the law, let me take a wild-ass...without looking at the law, let me take a wild-ass guess...<br /><br />The law exempts the police and firefighters even if they're texting while merging onto a busy expressway during rush hour traffic.<br /><br />The law does not exempt mere mortals when they glance at their todo list on their PDA while stopped at a red light.<br /><br />How did I do?Standard Mischiefhttp://standardmischief.com/blog/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-6847123939577386702011-06-27T21:59:45.204-04:002011-06-27T21:59:45.204-04:00AT,
"Tam's point, that attempting to leg...AT,<br /><br />"<i>Tam's point, that attempting to legislate Driving While ___________ is like trying to nail jello to a wall...</i>"<br /><br />The fuck it is.<br /><br />If somebody crosses the centerline, then you cite them for crossing the centerline, and who (other than Carrie Nation and you) gives a good goddam <i>WHY</i> they crossed the centerline?<br /><br />Because they were texting? Citation. Because they were drunk? Citation. Because they were a q-tip snowbird in FL pissing off AT? Ticket. The actionable offense it the SAME, Mr. Don't-Let-The-Government-Tell-Me-What-Time-To-Set-My-Clocks-To Al Terego.Tamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07285540310465422476noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-15907727.post-70135409436645425292011-06-27T20:45:15.948-04:002011-06-27T20:45:15.948-04:00"where there IS harm, there should be a SERIO..."where there IS harm, there should be a SERIOUS foul... (jail time at the minimum)"<br /><br />traditionally, negligence is a tort not a criminal act. Criminalizing negligence has become a slippery slope in our lawyer dominated government. Forget to tighten a bolt on the oil pipeline blind flange...go to jail. I'm not sure we should be OK with this.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com