Pretty sure that 'III' refers to the '3 percent' concept mentioned at Snowflakes in Hell the other day. Apparently, the 2nd Amendment super-hardliners have seized upon the idea that they're the 3 percent.
Christ, did I ever make a mistake in reading the comments on that thread. It took no time at all to descend into a dick comparison contest between chickenshit pussies. I bet one of the commentors was the mall ninja guys.
This is about the third time I've followed a link to that same flame war. I had to look through it again to find where III came from. I still don't have anything with the "molon labe" logo on it. I don't think I'll bother with the new logo. I never was much on following fashion trends.
Mebbe it's just my incompetence at web searching, or in communicating to what I believed were like minded cyber-folks -- BUT...
I have yet to find a site or web'rs who are making even the feebiest attempt to organize get about a million of u on the N'atl Mall in front of the White House, for even ONE day.
WE have plenty of numbers and plenty of motivation and Jeff Snyder has pretty well laid out a practicum to engage in Civil Liberties campaign, incl mass demonstrations and possible PEACEFUL civil disobedience.
It can be a win, and huge embarrassment to the grabbers. So far, all I have gotten is indignant roars of "I'm not gonna let the cops do this or that." and other uber-crap.
Shix, mon!! Dinna ya learn nothing from the Fed's ability to find and provoke classic propaganda situations. Please DO, play right into a media campaign designed to scare the crap outa the wuss people. Gunowners? Put 'em camps so we'll be safe.
sigh.
Guess I should go dry fire out the front window, dreaming of glorious patriotic death, shown on the Evening News as "Another Gun Fanatic Receives Classic FBI Justice" The ashes will be sifted for guns, before the debris is hauled to the landfill.
OH, BTW..yes, I have just as vehement dislike for the Worldwide Wuss Orgs and their Puppets. Mebbe my response is less rewarding than fantasizing about some Apocalyptic West Dream Shootout, but I warrant to you:
Show Up IN Wash DC, and non-violently shut down that Nat'l Mall-burg for a Week. Or even better, emulate the Veterans Encampment and do it for months. Peaceably. Intelligently. With Planning Aforethot, and Able Execution of OUR Propaganda. Let the Fed's become the BAD GUYS.
My prediction: Never, ever gonna happen, and eventually enuff stupid white men will do exactly what the grabbers and their pocket media want. Randy Weaver, Waco? SMALL potatoes, compared to the New Association of Sitting Gun Ducks --
3%'rs? More like IQ of Three. Or Third Grader. Can the emotional fervor and use the major head of y'r anatomy. We already have the winning hand. Why give it away with pointless wankerism?
And when someone DOES finally find a Civil Disobedience/Mass Demonstration site or Ass'n, it would be nice to see it spread across the GunBlog world as quickly as H-S's hapless head in the sand event.
But it won't happen. It won't happen preemptively, and prolly won't happen after the fact. For six months I have gotten a deafening silence on this subject, save for the gusts of testosterone apparently emanating from guys talking thru the zipper on their pants.
I'm actually against a "March on DC" until DC is forced to recognize CCW permits. It's too much of a liability.
Let's say we can actually get a million people to converge on DC. Great. How many of them, despite being told at every opportunity not to bring a gun, will...well...bring a gun? If it's even 3%, we'll be utterly crucified in the news (more so than usual). Not only will they claim that we're criminals, but they'll have proof. Some nutjob will probably even bring a real or realistic fake "assault rifle" and spook the city into breaking up the entire rally.
This doesn't even consider agent provocateurs, such as the anecdotal stories I've heard about anti-gunners showing up at gun shows with a bullet in their pocket so they can pull off an "accidental discharge."
As tempting as a march is, something that doesn't actually put so many people accustomed to carrying guns in a place where they can't carry guns is a risky move.
Re: the blog title quote from 'Red Dawn' and 'Longest Day' (and WWII Resistance, et al.)
There's a couple of morning drive-time DJ's here on the TX/LA Gulf Coast who have a recurring bit where "Wolverine" is the code word for the uprising against the government.
As for the idea of heading to DC for a week of protest? You don't find law-abiding gunowners engaged in that sort of activity, mainly because we are gainfully employed, and can't count on a gummint check to keep the kids fed.
Heh. I READ "Molon Labe!" Not sure what a "Real Patriot" is, these days. I never heerda this 3% stuff till today. Sounds kinda loud; better to put ear (web)plugs in. Can't stand any pointless " you ain't GOTS the GUTS!" screeching. Nothing like gun owners being perceived as represented by Yosemite Sam and pals.
The quickest way to change anything would be if gun-owners moved to CA and ran for office and the rest actually voted - we could do a Proposition-Gun to codify our rights (since the CA Constitution is absent a few things) and run the weenies out of state - and fix the car/smog problem bureaucracy at the same time. The Tinselgrad lefties could all move to Cannes, France where they belong anyhow.
1. fruitcakes packin' heat to a a mass Rally in DC.
a. attendance is not a family vacation, but a political statement, and one wherein you may face risk of arrest merely for being there.
I don't know how to prevent the feral-minded from ding as they please, however, I'd suggest an "on my honor as a responsible citizen and gun owner, I won't even carry so much as a sharp fingernail to this mass meeting."
Yes, you are at risk of violaters, and mebbe at personal risk by traveling unarmed. Who said that doing y'r duty to 'God and Country' was hazard free. It's a an act for FREEDOM, f'r crying out loud. Why would THAT be risk free?
DAS KOMITTEE of organization will have to have the PR and onsite protocols to deal with a violation[s].
b. Und DAS KOMITTEE will also have to address the problem regarding Agents of Crazedom creating 'incidents'. Expect it. I suppose one could make it plain that anyone getting caught doing so would be smeared with oxblood and tossed to the polar bears at the zoo, but that's hardly the spirit of things, now. Is it?
However, whether it's some form of security screening, the reason for which is made screamingly plain to ALL media, repeatedly. That is that we are EXPECTING the Loony Aunties to pull such stunts.
OR more creative minds may BRAIN-FERMENT something bettuh, and piz do, but I see no reason to keep saying, "It can't be done; de massa has done t'rowed a fright of possibilities on me."
As to expense, I'm writing this at 9PM 'cause that's when I got home from running my own small biz. Hell, yes, this is a costly enterprise to fund and execute. And it will mos' likely use vacation days away from family. And it may get you t'rowed in de pokey, f'r all any one knows?
How is that harder than engaging in a losing firefight out y'r living room window? Swear ta God, is WE all that dumb? I'd like to think not.
What WE are is, folks who are constitutionally minded to tend to our own biz. And we really don't grasp what drives the busybodies to get into our Shix, 'cause we know it's a bogus beef hatched in the wuss mind. Fearful people, them. We aren't fearful, in the sense that we are PREPARED for reality, and would like to think that we deal wit' it.
However, that gun owner mindset which excludes any alternate answers to the reality being thrust upon us except to return violence with violence, is no more valid than the gentle cooing of the last passenger pigeon. They died not of hunting and blood, but of habitat destruction.
I suggest that we do some active conservation, preemptive conservation, of our habitat RIGHT-all God A'mighty in the laps and faces of the plutocracy and their 'rule's r'us' minions. Don't need no steenkin' badges to do that, no bandoleers, neither.
Lettum turn loss some SWAT teams on peaceful demonstrations. Be organizationally prepared for it. Remember Ghandi's people having first aid stations, to treat the clubbed head wounds? MAKE the poo-leece and FEDS show what they are, in this case.
Don't say it can't be done. A buncha beatnik coffehouse drinkers just handily whipped us with nothing more than Ipods and MyFACEspace droolings by networking their feeb brains. And y'r sayin' WE ain't smart enuff to match THAT bunch?
Isn't there any org or group in the gun rights field that can see the obviousness -- and in the long run the cheapness and utility, of flexing feet on the ground muscle?
It doesn't seem so, but if one were to search the histories of how minority groups won concessions and influenced lawmakers with mass movements, do ya think mass protest marches woulda been high on the list? At least in civil societies that still retained a modicum of response to public opinion?
On, well. That's about it. I'm beat, going to bed, and doing it all over again tomorrow and forever, like about all the folks I know. Sure do wish I had such an easy answer as just saying, "Yeah, I'LL kill 'em and make them fight me and die gloriously after taking down hordes of the gun grabbing bastards."
Hey, like THAT won't make their day, eh? Why are folks catering to the door-buster gang? IT'S THEIR BUSINESS, y'know?;~`)
OK, just so's I have a place to hang a blog hat, it's WestEndOfLakeErie, under John the Red. Feelin' a bit of guilty riding on the coat tails here, entertaining as is the host[ess].
John the Red, Ever hear about the "Bonus Army"? Look it up, it should be educational.
With that in mind, tell me again just how your ideas will likely work out. Please take into consideration the way in which gun owners are portrayed by the MSM.
Yes, I am aware of the Bonus Army. It's High School American history. Today, it's fate would be a debacle for the government.
Planning for such an instance, and leveraging it to our advantage is a given. Tho, I envision a non-violent protest, there is no warrant that the powers that be will be smart enuff to let it go at that.
As to ideas working out? That predicates a good set of questions, with a great many specifics to be defined and codified. For an enterprise this size, it will damn near take a book. Starting with past protests, their organizational setup and after action critiques, will be a place to start.
And..the media? It IS our job to manage them, for a change. With a some amount of foresight, you can just about bet that there will be all sorts of efforts to 'spin'. The organizers' job will be to foresee, plan for, and manage/prevent such media propaganda.
As to criticism of this 'march', it's good to get hard questions and skepticism. The more the better, as these are relatively friendly compared to the reality surrounding such an event.
And, no, I don't have a bagful of cut and dried, carefully developed, committee-vetted protocols -- or enumerated goals. However, the primary result for which one would hope, is that the lawmakers have a strong and lasting impression of the voter and peaceful political power inherent in the gun owning community, next time they face anti-gun legislation.
I doubt you could find a million gun owners that wanted to visit Washington D.C. for any reason.
Isn't the whole idea of elected representatives that we get to send a person to speak for us there instead of having to go to that miserable ***thole ourselves?
Many of the III people are life long activists and write letters and speak with congressmen, we file lawsuits to get rights back, etc. Don't paint things monolithically that aren't. Makes you look silly.
I'm on speaking terms with David T. Hardy. Is he a bloviating idiot, too? I kind of find him a hero of mine, for all the scholarship he's done on what the Second Amendment really means.
Alleged Mall Ninja That Has Hunted Deer with .357 Magnums as well as with .375 Magnums, both in handgun form.
Three Percent refers to the percentage of the colonial population who fought the British during the Revolution. We do not claim to be 3% of the population but merely 3% of gun owners. Whatever the number it is still enough. Basic to our belief is the determination to obey no further federal gun control laws. If the raids begin, so be it. Not one step back.
Man, Tam you don't even need to practice splits when you have a Penn X two-speed. But the Bonus Army was hardly High School History in the 70's - it went unspoken and from what I understand today might not be more than a paragraph - but I don't know anybody now in High School or teaching it, and the Edu PhD's that I do know are a lot more like Ayers than Milius.
I gotta say that I've never heard of this III thing. Any idea where it comes from or what the symbolism behind it is supposed to be?
ReplyDeleteInsurance Information Institute? A formidable influence. "I'm...The Adjuster".
ReplyDeleteWV-diket-snark amongst y'selves.
Pretty sure that 'III' refers to the '3 percent' concept mentioned at Snowflakes in Hell the other day. Apparently, the 2nd Amendment super-hardliners have seized upon the idea that they're the 3 percent.
ReplyDeleteChrist, did I ever make a mistake in reading the comments on that thread. It took no time at all to descend into a dick comparison contest between chickenshit pussies. I bet one of the commentors was the mall ninja guys.
ReplyDeleteThis is about the third time I've followed a link to that same flame war. I had to look through it again to find where III came from. I still don't have anything with the "molon labe" logo on it. I don't think I'll bother with the new logo. I never was much on following fashion trends.
ReplyDeleteI'm GREEK. Pride in my heritage is not subject to fads.
ReplyDelete"I still don't have anything with the "molon labe" logo on it."
ReplyDeleteI was unaware it was a logo.
Note:
ReplyDeleteMebbe it's just my incompetence at web searching, or in communicating to what I believed were like minded cyber-folks -- BUT...
I have yet to find a site or web'rs who are making even the feebiest attempt to organize get about a million of u on the N'atl Mall in front of the White House, for even ONE day.
WE have plenty of numbers and plenty of motivation and Jeff Snyder has pretty well laid out a practicum to engage in Civil Liberties campaign, incl mass demonstrations and possible PEACEFUL civil disobedience.
It can be a win, and huge embarrassment to the grabbers. So far, all I have gotten is indignant roars of "I'm not gonna let the cops do this or that." and other uber-crap.
Shix, mon!! Dinna ya learn nothing from the Fed's ability to find and provoke classic propaganda situations. Please DO, play right into a media campaign designed to scare the crap outa the wuss people. Gunowners? Put 'em camps so we'll be safe.
sigh.
Guess I should go dry fire out the front window, dreaming of glorious patriotic death, shown on the Evening News as "Another Gun Fanatic Receives Classic FBI Justice" The ashes will be sifted for guns, before the debris is hauled to the landfill.
OH, BTW..yes, I have just as vehement dislike for the Worldwide Wuss Orgs and their Puppets. Mebbe my response is less rewarding than fantasizing about some Apocalyptic West Dream Shootout, but I warrant to you:
Show Up IN Wash DC, and non-violently shut down that Nat'l Mall-burg for a Week. Or even better, emulate the Veterans Encampment and do it for months. Peaceably. Intelligently. With Planning Aforethot, and Able Execution of OUR Propaganda. Let the Fed's become the BAD GUYS.
My prediction: Never, ever gonna happen, and eventually enuff stupid white men will do exactly what the grabbers and their pocket media want. Randy Weaver, Waco? SMALL potatoes, compared to the New Association of Sitting Gun Ducks --
3%'rs? More like IQ of Three. Or Third Grader. Can the emotional fervor and use the major head of y'r anatomy. We already have the winning hand. Why give it away with pointless wankerism?
And when someone DOES finally find a Civil Disobedience/Mass Demonstration site or Ass'n, it would be nice to see it spread across the GunBlog world as quickly as H-S's hapless head in the sand event.
But it won't happen. It won't happen preemptively, and prolly won't happen after the fact. For six months I have gotten a deafening silence on this subject, save for the gusts of testosterone apparently emanating from guys talking thru the zipper on their pants.
John the Red
West End of Lake Erie
I'm actually against a "March on DC" until DC is forced to recognize CCW permits. It's too much of a liability.
ReplyDeleteLet's say we can actually get a million people to converge on DC. Great. How many of them, despite being told at every opportunity not to bring a gun, will...well...bring a gun? If it's even 3%, we'll be utterly crucified in the news (more so than usual). Not only will they claim that we're criminals, but they'll have proof. Some nutjob will probably even bring a real or realistic fake "assault rifle" and spook the city into breaking up the entire rally.
This doesn't even consider agent provocateurs, such as the anecdotal stories I've heard about anti-gunners showing up at gun shows with a bullet in their pocket so they can pull off an "accidental discharge."
As tempting as a march is, something that doesn't actually put so many people accustomed to carrying guns in a place where they can't carry guns is a risky move.
Re: the blog title quote from 'Red Dawn' and 'Longest Day' (and WWII Resistance, et al.)
ReplyDeleteThere's a couple of morning drive-time DJ's here on the TX/LA Gulf Coast who have a recurring bit where "Wolverine" is the code word for the uprising against the government.
As for the idea of heading to DC for a week of protest? You don't find law-abiding gunowners engaged in that sort of activity, mainly because we are gainfully employed, and can't count on a gummint check to keep the kids fed.
Let the Fed's become the BAD GUYS
ReplyDeleteIf you'd read more of Mike Vanderboegh's writings, you'd see that's, ultimately, exactly what he advocates.
WV — jiwicat. What caliber for that?
And I thought "molon labe" was so, well, 480 B.C.
ReplyDeleteHeh. I READ "Molon Labe!" Not sure what a "Real Patriot" is, these days.
ReplyDeleteI never heerda this 3% stuff till today. Sounds kinda loud; better to put ear (web)plugs in. Can't stand any pointless " you ain't GOTS the GUTS!" screeching.
Nothing like gun owners being perceived as represented by Yosemite Sam and pals.
The quickest way to change anything would be if gun-owners moved to CA and ran for office and the rest actually voted - we could do a Proposition-Gun to codify our rights (since the CA Constitution is absent a few things) and run the weenies out of state - and fix the car/smog problem bureaucracy at the same time. The Tinselgrad lefties could all move to Cannes, France where they belong anyhow.
ReplyDeleteI like the III folks. As long as blatant sabre-rattling is going on, the folks working toward reform don't seem like the nutcases
ReplyDeletemore energy in morn, than now, but:
ReplyDelete1. fruitcakes packin' heat to a a mass Rally in DC.
a. attendance is not a family vacation, but a political statement, and one wherein you may face risk of arrest merely for being there.
I don't know how to prevent the feral-minded from ding as they please, however, I'd suggest an "on my honor as a responsible citizen and gun owner, I won't even carry so much as a sharp fingernail to this mass meeting."
Yes, you are at risk of violaters, and mebbe at personal risk by traveling unarmed. Who said that doing y'r duty to 'God and Country' was hazard free. It's a an act for FREEDOM, f'r crying out loud. Why would THAT be risk free?
DAS KOMITTEE of organization will have to have the PR and onsite protocols to deal with a violation[s].
b. Und DAS KOMITTEE will also have to address the problem regarding Agents of Crazedom creating 'incidents'. Expect it. I suppose one could make it plain that anyone getting caught doing so would be smeared with oxblood and tossed to the polar bears at the zoo, but that's hardly the spirit of things, now. Is it?
However, whether it's some form of security screening, the reason for which is made screamingly plain to ALL media, repeatedly. That is that we are EXPECTING the Loony Aunties to pull such stunts.
OR more creative minds may BRAIN-FERMENT something bettuh, and piz do, but I see no reason to keep saying, "It can't be done; de massa has done t'rowed a fright of possibilities on me."
As to expense, I'm writing this at 9PM 'cause that's when I got home from running my own small biz. Hell, yes, this is a costly enterprise to fund and execute. And it will mos' likely use vacation days away from family. And it may get you t'rowed in de pokey, f'r all any one knows?
How is that harder than engaging in a losing firefight out y'r living room window? Swear ta God, is WE all that dumb? I'd like to think not.
What WE are is, folks who are constitutionally minded to tend to our own biz. And we really don't grasp what drives the busybodies to get into our Shix, 'cause we know it's a bogus beef hatched in the wuss mind. Fearful people, them.
We aren't fearful, in the sense that we are PREPARED for reality, and would like to think that we deal wit' it.
However, that gun owner mindset which excludes any alternate answers to the reality being thrust upon us except to return violence with violence, is no more valid than the gentle cooing of the last passenger pigeon. They died not of hunting and blood, but of habitat destruction.
I suggest that we do some active conservation, preemptive conservation, of our habitat RIGHT-all God A'mighty in the laps and faces of the plutocracy and their 'rule's r'us' minions. Don't need no steenkin' badges to do that, no bandoleers, neither.
Lettum turn loss some SWAT teams on peaceful demonstrations. Be organizationally prepared for it. Remember Ghandi's people having first aid stations, to treat the clubbed head wounds? MAKE the poo-leece and FEDS show what they are, in this case.
Don't say it can't be done. A buncha beatnik coffehouse drinkers just handily whipped us with nothing more than Ipods and MyFACEspace droolings by networking their feeb brains. And y'r sayin' WE ain't smart enuff to match THAT bunch?
Isn't there any org or group in the gun rights field that can see the obviousness -- and in the long run the cheapness and utility, of flexing feet on the ground muscle?
It doesn't seem so, but if one were to search the histories of how minority groups won concessions and influenced lawmakers with mass movements, do ya think mass protest marches woulda been high on the list? At least in civil societies that still retained a modicum of response to public opinion?
On, well. That's about it. I'm beat, going to bed, and doing it all over again tomorrow and forever, like about all the folks I know. Sure do wish I had such an easy answer as just saying, "Yeah, I'LL kill 'em and make them fight me and die gloriously after taking down hordes of the gun grabbing bastards."
Hey, like THAT won't make their day, eh? Why are folks catering to the door-buster gang? IT'S THEIR BUSINESS, y'know?;~`)
But, that's just me. Feel free to be thee.
J-the-R
West End o' Lake Erie
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
ReplyDeleteOK, just so's I have a place to hang a blog hat, it's WestEndOfLakeErie, under John the Red. Feelin' a bit of guilty riding on the coat tails here, entertaining as is the host[ess].
ReplyDeleteJohn the Red,
ReplyDeleteEver hear about the "Bonus Army"? Look it up, it should be educational.
With that in mind, tell me again just how your ideas will likely work out. Please take into consideration the way in which gun owners are portrayed by the MSM.
Yes, I am aware of the Bonus Army. It's High School American history. Today, it's fate would be a debacle for the government.
ReplyDeletePlanning for such an instance, and leveraging it to our advantage is a given. Tho, I envision a non-violent protest, there is no warrant that the powers that be will be smart enuff to let it go at that.
As to ideas working out? That predicates a good set of questions, with a great many specifics to be defined and codified. For an enterprise this size, it will damn near take a book. Starting with past protests, their organizational setup and after action critiques, will be a place to start.
And..the media? It IS our job to manage them, for a change. With a some amount of foresight, you can just about bet that there will be all sorts of efforts to 'spin'. The organizers' job will be to foresee, plan for, and manage/prevent such media propaganda.
As to criticism of this 'march', it's good to get hard questions and skepticism. The more the better, as these are relatively friendly compared to the reality surrounding such an event.
And, no, I don't have a bagful of cut and dried, carefully developed, committee-vetted protocols -- or enumerated goals. However, the primary result for which one would hope, is that the lawmakers have a strong and lasting impression of the voter and peaceful political power inherent in the gun owning community, next time they face anti-gun legislation.
J t R
John,
ReplyDeleteI know that the "Million Gun Owner March" idea has been hashed out a few times at TFL over the years.
It might be worth searching through the archives there or at THR.
(Incidentally, while looking through the old threads there, I came across this thread from 1999...
Neat to see the old posts from cornered rat, Spectre, and Long Path.)
I doubt you could find a million gun owners that wanted to visit Washington D.C. for any reason.
ReplyDeleteIsn't the whole idea of elected representatives that we get to send a person to speak for us there instead of having to go to that miserable ***thole ourselves?
Many of the III people are life long activists and write letters and speak with congressmen, we file lawsuits to get rights back, etc. Don't paint things monolithically that aren't. Makes you look silly.
I'm on speaking terms with David T. Hardy. Is he a bloviating idiot, too? I kind of find him a hero of mine, for all the scholarship he's done on what the Second Amendment really means.
Alleged Mall Ninja That Has Hunted Deer with .357 Magnums as well as with .375 Magnums, both in handgun form.
As close to a Three Percent statement of purpose as I have come to yet is here:
ReplyDeletehttp://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2008/12/we-are-expendable-or-giving-battle-but.html
Mike Vanderboegh
PS to Tommy Paine the Ninth:
Three Percent refers to the percentage of the colonial population who fought the British during the Revolution. We do not claim to be 3% of the population but merely 3% of gun owners. Whatever the number it is still enough. Basic to our belief is the determination to obey no further federal gun control laws. If the raids begin, so be it. Not one step back.
Man, Tam you don't even need to practice splits when you have a Penn X two-speed.
ReplyDeleteBut the Bonus Army was hardly High School History in the 70's - it went unspoken and from what I understand today might not be more than a paragraph - but I don't know anybody now in High School or teaching it, and the Edu PhD's that I do know are a lot more like Ayers than Milius.
The Bonus Army was high school history for me, but then again my American History teacher was outstanding. (this was in the early 90s)
ReplyDelete