Thursday, April 14, 2011

Off-tackle left on 3. Ready? Break!

So, how's this year's drive looking so far? Kansas and Washington got suppressors; Arizona got campus carry; it looks like we're going to get a strong preemption law here in Indiana, as well as getting rid of the ridiculous requirement to have a pink card to transport a pistol to the range; the Illinois supreme court ruled that an out-of-state toter's permit works as well as a FOID for non-residents; Florida looks like they might get rid of their onerous concealment requirements; and what used to be called "Vermont Carry" is now "Vermont-Alaska-Arizona-Wyoming Carry".

And the other side...? *crickets*

The organizing... truly grassroots, populist, hydra-headed, leaderless... continues on internet gun forums across the country. Why, I can think of a dozen firearms forums off the top of my head with tens of thousands of members each. How many members does the largest antig... Wait. You know, I can't think of a single dedicated antigun forum?

And it's an easy sell for our side: All the stuff about the Second Amendment or basic rights or self-defense aside, it's fun. You can meet your shooting friends and go to the range and show off your new gun, all of which is a lot less isometric an exercise than going to the antirange and comparing unguns. It's a whole lot easier to give away free beer than free temperance, and a smile's an easier sell than a pickle-faced look of disapproval.

So, nope, no "Hail Marys" again this year. Just a steady trickle of stuff going in our favor again, like last year and the year before that and the... And when's the last time Paul Helmke had a reason to smile?


Will Brown said...

The last time George Soros' check cleared?

Borepatch said...

You know how bad it is? Mom said she'd go to the range with me. Now that Dad is gone, she is a little nervous at night by herself.

After being a strong liberal - and orthodoxly anti-gun- for maybe 50 years - she sees why someone might need one.

I don't have any idea whether she'll get one (I'll probably get one for her, if she'll let me).

Byt when the Brady crowd loses Mom, you can stick a fork in them. They're done.

Tam said...

Thirty years ago they could be straightforward enough about their goals to have an organization named "National Coalition To Ban Handguns". My, my, how times have changed.

On the national level, their high-water mark was 1994, where they blew every bit of political capital they had to squeak through the "AWB" (and even then they needed to put a time limit on it) and in the process they got the Democrat's fingers burned so badly that they have largely avoided the issue for better than fifteen years now.

TBeck said...

I'm pretty sure Helmke cracked a grin the day Rep. Giffords was shot.

Boyd said...

And when's the last time Paul Helmke had a reason to smile?

I think it was when he got invited to the White House to not-meet the President.

Marty said...

In VA you can now carry in bars, churches, state parks, employer and school parking lots.

We are on the edge of Constitutional Carry. No CCP required.

Life is good.

Lawyer said...

Sometimes, steady progress is the best kind of progress there is.

Anonymous said...

"If your (gov) has dumb laws...change the laws."

"It's a process..."

Yup. A more than thirty year process since all short-barrel handguns were deemed "saturday night specials" and were in real danger of being the degree that a Mo. 36 or a PPK/S cost more then than now, if you could find one.

If we live long enough, freedom may find us again.

Or if not, at least maybe we'll be ready to face her evil opposite.

And maybe Hoosiers will even be allowed to carry a knife.


Tam said...


"And maybe Hoosiers will even be allowed to carry a knife."

What? Yeah, switchblades are a no-go here, I guess because John Dillinger used one, but there's no prohibition on "carrying a knife". Or pepper spray.

You do need a LTCH to carry a taser or stun gun, although why you'd want to is beyond me.

I don't know where you get your information, AT, but I'm using my handy copy of the Indiana Criminal Code I got from Shootin' Buddy.

Son of Sam Adams said...

And soon you'll be able to carry in bars in long as you don't drink. Brick by brick...

S. L. Haynes said...

Good run down on the changing times and recoup of stolen freedom. I'm working on Constitutional Carry in Texas and have started a blog/web site to help promote this cause. To help out, all Texas fans of Tam please visit:

TXGunGeek said...

Unfortunately, it looks more and more like they may have won in Texas. The VPC/BB. whoever have put considerable pressure on Texas Legislators and got two to pull their support for Campus Carry. Not sure if it will pass now.

Jay G said...

Meanwhile in Massachusetts...


Hold on here...


Our licenses now fit in our wallets!

In better news, NH is also on the list for Constitutional Carry...

Tam said...


"Unfortunately, it looks more and more like they may have won in Texas."

No, they are continuing to lose. "Winning" would indicate that they were making progress, rather than merely stalling a bill that will, no doubt, be back next session if it doesn't pass in this one.

You don't win by holding your opponent to short gains, you win by getting the ball and moving it the other way. Our side learned this in '94 and we've been doing it ever since.

doubletrouble said...

Tam- you forgot us up here in NH!
The house passed HB330 (Concarry) & it should keep on truckin'.
Last year they let us play with automatic knives.

staghounds said...

This pro gun blog isn't doing so well...

Tam said...


I didn't want jinx it before the Governor signed. ;)

zeeke42 said...

There's quite a bit going on in the courts as well. Most near and dear to me, of course, is Hightower v Boston, which should sort out some of our most egregious licensing problems. Comm2A has a few more cases up their sleeve also; we should see another one this summer.

There are tons of other cases going on around the country. Based on the oral arguments, Chicago's gun range ban will fall soon. There are carry cases in 4 or 5 different circuits.

Stranger said...

Two things have turned the tide. The internet, which let's people actually look up what's going on in places like England instead of taking Pravda West's word for it: and also cuts the shooting community's response time from three months to perhaps as long as three hours.

The second thing is the continuing decline in the violent crime rate as more and more rational gun laws are enacted. It is really hard for the anti's to deny either the increase in the number of guns in circulation, or the decline in violent crime rates.


Jake (formerly Riposte3) said...

@Marty: FYI, there's already a state Senator promising to introduce a guns in church ban in the next session.

I'm guessing it will die in committee, but we need to watch it.

And hopefully Virginia's Constitutional Carry bill won't die next session. At least this year it was killed by a drafting error, and not by enemy action.

Gewehr98 said...

Optimism in the 2A fight is nice, but I'm reminded every day that there's no rest for the wicked. Good ol' Sarah is back on the 10-round magazine bandwagon, as seen in the local Madison papers just last month:

perlhaqr said...

the Illinois supreme court ruled that an out-of-state toter's permit works as well as a FOID for non-residents

Does this affect Chicago? It would be cool if my girlfriend could take her pistol with her and keep up on her practice when she has to go to her corporate offices.

Keith said...

In AZ we did not get unrestricted campus carry. One can carry on sidewalks and roads IE public right of ways, but not in the buildings. I am also unsure just what constitutes a public right of way as the local collage is filled with sidewalks so I'll have to look into it. Still were on the march and next time perhaps we can get the buildings too.

Shootin' Buddy said...

"Good ol' Sarah is back on the 10-round magazine bandwagon, as seen in the local Madison papers just last month"

Oh, noes, a Brady press release! Run for the hills all is lost.

Quick, name a Brady Bunch victory.

We make steady progress, despite the Internetz fact that the NRA is the largest gun control organization in the world, while the Brady Bunch makes press releases.

Shootin' Buddy

Tam said...


"Optimism in the 2A fight is nice, but I'm reminded every day that there's no rest for the wicked."

Yup. We just picked up another four yards on an off tackle left run. That doesn't mean we get to all run to the sidelines and drink Gatorade.

But I think we've demonstrated that our side knows this. ;)

Bubblehead Les. said...

Hope the Liberal Zebra's on the Fed Courts don't keep stopping the Game and putting up 15 yard Penalties even though Instant Replay shows that they were wrong. But that is what one gets when one tries to be Bipartisan and Reach across the Aisle in the Senate: LifeTime Marxists on the Bench.

BobG said...

"I can't think of a single dedicated antigun forum?"

They don't need one, they have the mainstream media.
We are making strides, but I think we need to keep a close eye on the present federal administration; I don't trust them not to try pulling something while people aren't looking.

Matt G said...

Regarding Texas, we are making some gains.

Ten years ago, as a patrol officer, I'd come across perhaps 5 concealed carry licenses a year, and those would rarely have their guns on them.

Now, I see that many a month (note: CHL holders really don't commit many traffic violations), and a lot of people I run across tell me that they don't bother getting a CHL, since for the last 6years in Texas you can carry to and from and in your car, so long as it's concealed and you're not committing a Class B misdemeanor or greater.

Also, we've increased the time between renewals for CHLs without raising the price (in 16 years!), and added to places where CHL carry is allowed.

Also, our governor has a CHL and is proud to let you know it.

Davidwhitewolf said...

Heh. Here in California, our governor has an "arsenal." So there! :p

But we're making steady progress, too. Shall-issue concealed carry's next on the list, lots coming up after that.

Noah D said...

Me, I'd like to see campus carry in Indiana, or at least a clear (read: any) definition of a 'school' in the Indiana Code.

Tam said...


"They don't need one, they have the mainstream media."

Apparently they do, because even with the MSM in their hip pocket, they keep getting beaten like a rented mule.

There are only two constituencies that have really grasped the power of teh internets for forcing change: The GLBT and Gun Rights. The difference is that the GLBT has had the full backing of the MSM while the Gun Rights movement has had to face the full opposition of the Old Media. And yet Gun Rights have been moving forward despite all the best efforts of the Legacy Media...

atlharp said...

We are making great strides with Castle Doctrine this year in Norte Kakalaki. We have a gun in bars and parks bill that will probably end up being passed along with some other goodies to clean up the idiocy left by the Democrats that fouled the state house for the last century. All in all it's been pretty easy gliding for guns in this session.

Will said...

If Congress accepts the UN's gun control treaty that Mz Clinton is working on, we may be totally hosed in one shot.
I wonder if this will be what touches off our next revolution. Could be "interesting times" ahead.

Sigivald said...

Will: Congress won't. See how easy that was?

It's like saying "if Congress decided to ban all [private possession of] guns tomorrow, we'd be hosed in one shot".

It's true, admittedly.

But it's not something worth worrying about, because Congress knows it'd be political suicide.

As was pointed out above, they know that even trying a magazine-size ban is a loser - and what with Heller, the idea of a treaty abrogating the 2nd Amendment is not even plausible.

The question has not been directly addressed, as as far as I know Congress has never even tried to ratify a treaty that was in obvious conflict with the Constitution, but I'm not exactly quaking in my boots worrying about it - if we're in a situation where it's politically popular to do so and the supreme court would uphold it we've already lost.

But we're not in that situation, or even remotely near it.

Anonymous said...

Maine now permits switchblades for one handed people.

Not ready to cutback that much just yet to take advantage of it.

Matt G said...

Neatly said, Sigivald.

Anonymous said...

"I don't know where you get your information, AT..."

Is it wrong?


perlhaqr said...

AT: That link is specifically talking about concealed carry of weapons other than handguns or pistols, not general carry of them.

staghounds said...

I'd add stockholders in legacy media, recording, publishing, and department store companies.

Not that they are USING the web to change things, but they have felt its powrer.

Chris said...

Maryland State Legislature (at least the majority Democrats): dedicated antigun forum

Mild snark. A few of the Dems here, from the more rural areas, are not antigun. But all the ones from the major population areas (Baltimore City and the DC suburbs) are doctrinaire antigun.

Sebastian said...

That guy always smiles. It's actually kind of creepy. One of these days he's going to get hauled off in cuffs because police discovered he was the Fort Worth Strangler.

(NOTE: I don't know if Ft. Worth ever had a strangler, but if it did, he'd probably smile like Helmke)

NotClauswitz said...

California is now selling S&W M&P15 AR's (with a bullet button) and old Governor Moonbeam proudly proclaims he has three guns - ok so it's not like a Texas governor who might say "I'm goin' to a three-gun shoot," but hey it's a start. And we can still open-carry (unloaded).

Anonymous said...


Yes, thanks, it is the concealed-carry reciprocity list for Fla to be exact.

My question was if that site, which is headlined as being "ALWAYS CURRENT", isn't...or if SB's ICC book isn't.


Tam said...


"Is it wrong?"

It is correct that Indiana does not have "concealed weapons permits" but rather a "license to carry a concealed handgun".

However Indiana law is mum on carrying knives, regardless of their length or how many edges they have or whether they fold or are fixed. You can carry them open or concealed, with or without a permit. There's something in the code about school grounds, but I didn't go look it up.

Likewise, the law doesn't say boo about OC or tear gas or mace or whatever. If you want to carry some of that, go 'head.

The law does define "tasers and stun guns" as handguns for the purpose of carrying one around for some reason, so if you don't have a toter's permit, you can't carry one either concealed or open.

Sticks, batons, ASPs, and suchlike? Carry away. The law doesn't say anything about them either.

Like many states, automatic knives are a no-no if you're not a policeman, because hoodlums in that Blackboard Jungle movie scared half the legislators in America back in the Fifties.

One peculiarity about Hoosier law is that we recognize all toter's permits from other states and foreign countries, but only "according to the terms thereof", so theoretically a Texan who brought his gun here couldn't carry it in a bar, just like if he was back in Texas, and a Floridian would have to keep his covered up... I dunno that there's ever been case law on that, though.

Anonymous said...

So the Fla website that starts out:

"PLEASE NOTE: The reciprocity information on this page is ALWAYS CURRENT. The Division of Licensing constantly monitors changing gun laws in other states..."

is not only NOT current, but outright wrong when it footnotes the law in Ind and a bunch of other states with this:

"(1) While Florida's law allows licensees to carry stun guns, knives, and billy clubs in a concealed fashion, the laws in these states allow for concealed carry of handguns or pistols ONLY, NOT WEAPONS IN GENERAL."

Oh well, exactitude is probably not a priority; read further on the site to see that first on the list of places where carry is not allowed in Fla is "any place of nuisance". Now there's a malleable term for ya.

Still, it's confusion and ambiguity in these regs that have the potential for some ignorant popo to have a lawful licensee up against a wall.

And you want peculiarity? Fla's reciprocity does not extend to residents of the least-regulated state; the terms by law mirror the issuing state's, and since Vermont doesn't issue one...'monsters can't carry here. Go figure.


Tam said...


"Still, it's confusion and ambiguity in these regs that have the potential for some ignorant popo to have a lawful licensee up against a wall."

As I used to explain to customers back in my Georgia days: "Georgia law allows you to carry a loaded pistol in your car as long as it's not concealed (ie. on the seat, the dashboard, or the package tray in the rear window) or in a lockable compartment like a glovebox or pickup truck console. What this means is that a cop in BFE probably won't say 'Boo' about it if he pulls you over of a Tuesday afternoon, and you'll get your gun back after the case is thrown out of court after a City of Atlanta cop has bounced your face off your hood at 3AM on a Saturday morning..."

Unknown said...

Did you count Iowa? As of 1/1/11 all out-of-State CCW permits are valid as long as the holder follows IA’s rules.

FatWhiteMan said...

The "other side" got to make up a brand new word so they can ban it -- "Assault Clips".

Tam said...


They're already banned everyplace the other side has a hope in hell of banning them.