Monday, May 02, 2011

Pants On Fire.

From the BBC:
1337: Wajid Shamsul Hasan, Pakistan's High Commissioner in London, tells the BBC World Service he "wouldn't buy the story that Pakistan would have been kept in the dark" about the operation in Abbottabad: "Pakistani authorities and the CIA and the American intelligence network have always been working 24 hours-a-day, cooperating with each other, sorting out things, so there has been total cooperation between them," he said.
You're so full of it that your eyes are brown, Wajid.

I can easily prove that the Pakistani government was not told ahead of time by the simple fact that Bin Laden was there when the door was kicked in and not somewhere miles over the horizon.

There are many ways to get information into the hands of terrorists quickly, such as telephone or television, but none are as fast as telePakistaniIntelOfficer.


McVee said...

I know! How'd you like to sit in that Monday morning meeting. :) Someones got some splaining to do.
Still. The thing still does'nt sit right with Me. Hmmm. 10 years with kidney failure. WTF?

Mark B. said...

And following on your analysis, Tam, I'm wondering how long it's gonna be before Pakistan's government protests "in the strongest possible terms" the fact that United States armed forces operating autonomously on sovereign Pakastani soil carried out the raid that got the bastard. It's not like they took our raids on their Afghan border a few years ago all that well . . .


Unknown said...

Too right. It's time we pulled the funding stream to Pakistan. There's no way they didn't know; and even if they didn't, that's just as bad. Man, do they look stupid right now.

Anonymous said...

Mark B. - I'm wondering how long it's gonna be before Pakistan's government protests "in the strongest possible terms" the fact that United States armed forces operating autonomously on sovereign Pakastani soil carried out the raid that got the bastard.

I wonder if that ridiculous statement from Wajid Shamsul Hasan was intended as a signal from Islamobad that they WON'T make a big deal about it. Let's face it: we just kicked in THEIR door, too, and showed that our guys can go in and zero out ANYBODY in Pakistan without them even know we're coming. That's just GOT to make a lot of people in Islamobad sleep sooooo much easier. NOT.

"Hello. You have reached the Pakistani presidential palace. How can we cooperate with you today?"

Borepatch said...

I have to think some on this, but my gut says that it goes something like this:

1. There are two (or more) factions in the Pakistani government in general, and the ISI in particular. Pro-west and pro-Islamist. These factions hate each other, and this is the political Great Game played in Islamabad.

2. The pro-Islamist faction knew that Osama was there. Certainly not all the details, because three people can keep a secret if two of them are dead. But Osama's house was within spitting distance of a military academy, for crying out loud. Someone knew something.

3. This is pretty embarrassing to the Pakistani government - the dirty laundry has been hung out for everyone to see. This gives us an opportunity to demand that they let us take out a set of high value targets that they've been protecting. The Pro-west faction will push this, as this advances their side in the Great Game.

4. I have absolutely no idea whether the current administration has the brains or the stones to do this. Petraeus has the brains, and runs CIA now. It will be interesting to watch.

I'll have to post at the end of the day, but I have a Google Earth shot of Osama's house next to the military academy. Someone knew SOMETHING.

As always, your mileage may vary, void where prohibited, do not remove tag under penalty of law. The problem with Intelligence work is that you're trying to put together a jig saw puzzle with only a quarter of the pieces.

tanksoldier said...

I dunno. He was living in a mansion in a nice neighborhood... and no one in US intelligence community knew? This may put me in the tinfoil hat crowd, but I think Obama was keeping Osama in the same place he kept the birth certificate: his hip pocket, ready for a rainy day or advantageous political opportunity.

Mark B. said...

docjim and Borepatch:

Good points, both.


Bubblehead Les. said...

"With Friends like these..."

Anonymous said...

It is not possible that the ISI or PSSG did not know where he was living. They may have been protecting him or they may have been letting him be but they knew he was there.

I'll be handing out pork rinds and beer in honor of the day.


Henry Blowfly said...

Borepatch; good assessment. I concur, especially about he pro and anti West factions in Pakistan's Intelligence Service.

Whether or not the Pakistani government was kept in the loop is something that we will probably never know for certain. International implications either way.

Unknown said...

I agree with tanksoldier. I don't think this was so much as a "gee, there he is" story so much as it was a "he's no longer leading us to other bad people, so now would be a good time to take him out."

OBL may not have been an active threat against the US for awhile, but he bumped shoulders with lots of people that we wanted to kill. Why not wait until he's led you to all of them?

Brad K. said...


I think it likely that *someone* in Pakistan's government was informed, but not *all* of Pakistan's government.

I mean, look at all that B. Hussein Obama won't tell our own Congress. (Refuses to testify about dropping charges over voter intimidation/New Black Panthers, won't submit nominees for Senate confirmation, won't list who is on the secret no-fly list and won't tell how names are added, etc.)

Tam said...


"... and no one in US intelligence community knew?"

They've known since August.

Ken said...

C.G.B. Spender strikes again!

"I can kill you any time I want to...

...and today's the day."

Kristophr said...

From the India Times:

"However, last week Pakistan's army chief, General Ashfaq Pervez Kayani, told the passing out parade of cadets from the Kakul military academy that Pakistan had broken the back of terrorism in the country. The killing of bin Laden within few hundred metres distance from the military academy has evaporated Kiyani's tall claim into thin air."

That PMA Kakul facility is getting some interesting reviews from Google Maps users.

Anonymous said... question that begs an answer. If Pakistan is an ally...why destroy a 6 million dollar helicopter on the ground? Tom C. Eastern Montana

Scout26 said...

I could sworn I heard Barry say in the speech that we DID NOT tell the Paki's anything about what we knew or what we were going to do with knowledge.

wv:Cessboa, what you wear when you're down in the dumps.

Anonymous said...

Video of the raid:

Islamic tradition, FTW!


perlhaqr said...

Wow, that video is awesome.

Drang said...

I suspect that RUMINT that the Paks were in on the raid are based on confusion of terms: A "Joint" operation includes members of multiple services, all US. A "Combined" operations includes non-US personnel.
My guess is, SEALS (and possibly D-Boys or members of some other Army unit that does not exist providing unspecified support) flown in on MH60s, with Little Birds covering them.

As for letting the paks know, I think Blackfive said it: The three best ways to let AQ know what you're up to are telephone, television, and tellaPakistaniIntelOfficer...

Mister_V said...

Know what would be funny? If they dumped Bin Laden's corpse in the Bay of Pigs.

Tam said...


"My guess is, SEALS (and possibly D-Boys or members of some other Army unit that does not exist providing unspecified support) flown in on MH60s, with Little Birds covering them. "

RUMINT is DEVGRU in a brace of MH-47's.

Anonymous said...

Mister_V, I haven't laughed that hard in a long time. Thanks. JD

Stretch said...

The chopper was most likely destroyed to keep communication, navigation or other electronics from falling into Paki hands.
If there was a delay in the raid it was probably to allow the intel community to further track sources and gather data.
I dare say a large number of ISI members are wondering "Who did I talk to when ..."
Of course this would all be moot if we still had The Corps Guides, The Malakand Field Force and Skinner's Horse. Sigh, time for more Kipling and port.

Anonymous said...

It is interesting to consider that at this point there is still no proof that any of the described events actually happened. I don't suggest that it didn't, only that it hasn't been proven.


Tam said...


The strongest proof is that Hamas, the Taliban, etc., haven't all started issuing denials.

Kristophr said...

We'll get you the long-form death certificate, Jim.

Anonymous said...

Even if they were to offer proof--pictures, video, an embalmed corpse, signed affidavits from the survivors--the nutjobs among us would be picking it apart, looking for anything not easily explainable as evidence of a cover-up, and it would just feed their squirrelly brains even more.


wv: socklit: how dirty must socks be before they start illuminating your dresser drawer?

staghounds said...

It's like Hitler was living in Columbus, Georgia in 1944.

ISI = I Spill Immediately

Matt G said...

The Pakistanis are quietly admitting that they're stunned, and knew nothing about the raid beforehand.

The conspiracists should have their first drafts out this evening, about how Bin Laden either
A: Wasn't there and thus was not killed, OR
B: Was there but was captured and is being questioned, in exchange for his freedom, OR
C: Was there and was captured, and was then killed in enhanced questioning, and the evidence had to be destroyed, OR
D: ?