Tuesday, July 14, 2009

Wicked flinch...

So I was doing some gun kata with my Ring's blue gun (which used a Springfield Operator for the mold gun)...

I may have mentioned before that the rear Novak on the mold gun was drifted hard to the right. Today I noticed that not only is it drifted to the right, but it's suspiciously tall as well. It has that really steep, ski-jump look, like the rear sight for a Champion or Ultra... I compared it to my carry gun, a 5" Springfield.

Yup. It was way taller.

Why would someone install a taller rear sight and drift it to the right? (Hint: to move your point of impact with the sights, remember the mantra "F.O.R.S. = Front, opposite. Rear, same.")

Looks like someone was seeking a hardware solution for a software problem.

13 comments:

Noah said...

That's pretty funny. I was part of a conversation on Independence Day that reminds me of your post...

"I really like my new XD, but it shoots really low and left. I don't know why Springfield Armory didn't sight it in correctly, I'll send it back."

Uhh.... Alrighty then.

Kristopher said...

Tightening fingers or jerking the trigger.

Anonymous said...

Heh. Reminds me of a guitar player we once had, who swore blind that our electronic metronome worked perfectly until he started playing, then it would shift tempo all over the place. He thought we were playing a sophisticated trick on him.

I once witnessed a shooter hitting the ground halfway between the shooting position and the seven yard, shoulder-height target. Sorry; the sights just won't move that far. Anyway, that's why we start with .22s, and some dry fire, then move up in caliber, then more dry fire. When they start missing, it's back to dry fire, after which they hit POA with the first shot every time. -- Lyle

Robert said...

I made a hardware correction to my 1911 to adjust my point of aim, but I don't think I was flinching. I shoot my Baby Eagle 45 and XD9 ok, but my new 1911 was low and left. After I installed some thicker grips, everything was fine.

Tam said...

Yup.

If you're used to a thicker grip, and then try to shoot a gun with a really skinny grip and a light trigger, it's easy to drop shots low and left because your hand isn't clamping down as tightly on the skinnier gun. It's a whole lot easier and more practical to make the grip thicker than it is to try and make your hand switch back and forth.

This is why I only make my hand learn two grip/trigger setups: DA Smith and SA 1911. I even go with the jumbo backstraps on my AR's, because it gives roughly the same trigger reach as my 1911's. My head knows it's shooting a carbine, but my hand is dumb and thinks it's a 1911...

Steve Skubinna said...

Maybe the person was, ummm, right handed but left eye dominant. And had very long arms. Or a short neck.

The Management said...

Hi,

I get the gist of the story, someone with bad shooting form tried to compensate by modifying the sights.

However, I don't quite understand F.O.R.S. = Front, opposite. Rear, same.

I know right and left handed people tend to shot predictably one way or the other. I just don't understand how FORS plays into it.

Can anyone explain please. I hate not knowing stuff :)

ErnestThing said...

Had the same thing with a used GP100 I picked up in practically new condition.

Part of me was sad that a new shooter didn't seek help resolving their shooting problem, and may have sold their new gun and left the shooting sports for good.

But another part of me couldn't get over the great deal I got. :)

Tam said...

"I know right and left handed people tend to shot predictably one way or the other. I just don't understand how FORS plays into it."

The rear sight on the mold gun was taller than normal and drifted hard right. This would indicate that the shooter was compensating for a point of impact that was very low and left with the standard sights. Based on prior experience, I'd bet $5 that the owner of that gun was right-handed, as that's a classic flinch.

BTW: Go to a gun store that has a large selection of used handguns. Look at how many of them have the rear sight adjusted up and to the right. I'll bet it's as many as half.

Tam said...

Oh, FORS is a reference to moving the point of impact with adjustable sights: Move the front sight in the opposite direction you want the bullet hole to go, and the rear sight in the same direction.

Weer'd Beard said...

Is the front post a standard hight?

Didn't the Operator have a threaded barrel for a suppressor? That would require taller sights.

I can see drifting the sights wayyyy over to try and solve and undiagnosed flinch, but actually installing new sights, seems like the person would learn first.

Tam said...

"Didn't the Operator have a threaded barrel for a suppressor?"

Nope. 1911's are considered fairly tricky to suppress, anyway. The Kimber we had at CCA took more than just a drop-in barrel before it ran 100% reliably with a Blackside. And yes, the front is standard height.

"I can see drifting the sights wayyyy over to try and solve and undiagnosed flinch, but actually installing new sights,"

Seen it done too many times to count.

The Management said...

Thanks Tam,

I was making that way more complicated in my head. I thought it was a trick for not pulling ones shots. Never would have thought it was sight adjustment.

Great customer service here at your blog!

Dave